What the hell happened to all of my old (Prior) Social Security Applications and why can’t I go back to the old application date?
Oh, I know you know about this one. You get ready for a hearing and you are told that they are going to look at your case from a particular date of application but you KNOW that you have filed a few times before and YOU want to know WHY are they NOT considering those old applications. And why is this important? It’s because you KNOW that you’ve been disabled for a while and you think they need to understand so they don’t cut out your benefits. Will, let me get YOU right so get ready to read!!
Ok, ok, I’m sure quite a few of you have heard me give a break down of different things relating to Social Security but today, I have go over a topic that I get asked THOUSANDS of time. It’s really weird from a technical standpoint so I’m going to break it down into two parts. Part I is titled LEGAL talk and this is where I will discuss the various standards that Social Security relies on to make their determination. Part II is titled BEAT talk and this is the part where I will discuss how people tend to get into this situation and the little things that you do that may impact your ability to get your old application reopened.
PART I - LEGAL talk
If you get denied on your application and you refile, you may be able to request your prior file be re-opened. However, for purposes of my discussion, I’m going to give you a hypothetical scenario so you can see how this work. In the course of the discussion, I will rely on references 20 CFR 404.988, 20 CFR 404.989, 20 CFR 416.1488, and 20 CFR 416.1489.
HYPO: Let’s say that you filed an application on JANUARY 1, 2006 and you got your initial denial on MAY 1, 2006. Here’s what may happen if you re-file again on the below listed dates:
1) RE-FILE DATE DECEMBER 31, 2006 (It should be able to re-open automatically)
The regulations provide that if you re-file a new application, for any reason within 12 months from the date of the notice of the initial determination, it can be re-opened automatically (either by requesting it or SSA may do it by themselves). So under the example I just provided you, since you filed a new application within the 12 month window from MAY 1, 2006, you can re-open your JANUARY 1, 2006 application.
2) RE-FILE DATE JUNE 1, 2009 (Depends on your type of case and it depends on your reason for asking)
Here’s the point where you need to know what kind of case you have. If you have a case under Title II (which is Disability Insurance Benefits), you can request a re-opening because your reapplication occurred within 4 years of the May 1, 2006 determination (4 years from your initial determination in this hypothetical). However, under Title XVI (Supplemental Security Income), you only have 2 years from that date to ask. Since you were denied on May 1, 2006, you had up until May 1, 2008 to file a new application and ask for the old one to be re-opened. Since you re-filed on June 1, 2009, you are not within the window. Now, remember what I said in point #1. Within 12 months of the initial determination, you can ask for it to be re-opened for any reason. Beyond that 12 months (but within the window, DIB within 4 years and for SSI within 2 years), you gotta have a good reason. And here is what they consider:
(1) New and material evidence is furnished;
New meaning something that relates to the period of time to explain WHY you didn’t re-apply right away and it must be relevant (MATERIAL) to your case.
(2) A clerical error in the computation or recomputation of benefits was made; or
(3) The evidence that was considered in making the determination or decision clearly shows on its face that an error was made.
3) RE-FILED because you found out and realized that someone was using your information and SSA applied their information to you.
You can RE-FILE and ask for a Reopening, for any time if,
(1) It was obtained by fraud or similar fault ;
(2) Another person files a claim on the same earnings record and allowance of the claim adversely affects your claim;
(3) A person previously determined to be dead, and on whose earnings record your entitlement is based, is later found to be alive;
(4) Your claim was denied because you did not prove that a person died, and the death is later established—
(i) By a presumption of death; or
(ii) By location or identification of his or her body
PART II BEAT Talk
Alright, now that we got the legal MUMBO jumbo part out of the way, let me get down to the DIRTY and tell you why it is sometimes difficult to get your old applications re-opened:
1) Your last application is so long ago that there is NO way they are going to re-open it.
The one thing I wanted to make clear is that there are timelines for requesting your old applications to be re-opened. I’m sorry if you applied in 1994 and you have been out of work the entire time. However, if you can’t show that there was some fraud involved or someone used your information or something else as referred to above, SSA is NOT going to go ALL the way back to 1994 if you reapplied beyond the SSI (2 year) and DIB (4 year) window.
2) You were in prison during the time between your current applications and your new one.
Now, in theory, if you’re within the period of time, you could request a re-opening. Let’s say under the hypo I provided, you were denied on May 1, 2006, you went to prison on May 30, 2006 and you didn’t get out until November 1, 2007. So you reapplied that day and you want to go back to May 1, 2006. Of course, you got a good reason. You were in prison. You way have a good reason but (under the regulations), they can’t pay you for any time you were in prison. Now, if you have DIB claim where you are indicating that you were disabled up to a year before the application, you may want to request the re-opening. However, if you have an SSI claim, you can only get paid from the date of the application so why would they re-open that old application?
3) “I didn’t know I could appeal”.
I have heard this one a MILLION times. Now, let’s get real. Unless you have a cognitive problem or you have a low IQ or you were under some type of extreme emotional or physical situation, you are probably NOT going to get ANY sympathy from Social Security for the “I didn’t know I could appeal” reason. Those decisions that SSA generate are SO detailed that they explain two or three times about your RIGHT to appeal.
4) “I was going through some things” (You better be specific, dammit, and it better be good and you better have proof).
Now, let’s be honest here. You are going to have some situations where you are in a devastating circumstance. Your loved one died. You went through traumatic divorce. Something of that nature. In some instances, SSA may be sympathetic. However, SSA is not dumb. They are going to want SOMETHING to demonstrate that you did go through what you went through to support your assertion.
5) You were working.
And this is another one I’ve seen. people, the FIRST step of the SSA process is “Are you performing a Substantial Gainful activity?”. In other words, are you working? Say (like under the HYPO), you applied on Jan. 1, 2006. You were denied on May 1, 2006. You went back to work. Now, it’s not that simple. If you only worked a few weeks or you tried a month here and a month there with no success, you might get some sympathy (depending on your reason for not working). However, if you went back to work on May 2, 2006 and worked until June 2008 and you earned $14000 a year but now you’re saying that you were struggling and so you can’t do it, you might get the hoochie lips from SSA. Why? Did i mention that you earned $14000 a year? and OH, SSA knows that you earned $14,000 so if you can’t explain how you worked under some special set of circumstances, you are probably not going to get that old application re-opened.
I I know that so many people find themselves reapplying for disability benefits so I wanted to make sure that I took the opportunity give some insight into how this situation works so you can understand why your old applications may or may not be affected.
NEWS FLASH: ALMOST every source of money can impact your Supplemental Security Income (SSI) check so GET ready!
If you decide not to read the rest of this post, take this ONE sentence to heart if you are receiving Supplemental Security Income:
“EVERY SOURCE OF MONEY OR RESOURCES can affect your SSI CHECK!!”
WHOOOT, DERE IT IS, DAMMIT!!
I know you may think I’m being stank but it’s important that you understand how this program works. So here’s a few things that you need to consider:
1) SSI is a NEED BASED PROGRAM. The MORE you get from someone else, the LESS you need from SSI!
SSI is a Need Based Program. This means that if you are found disabled and you don’t have the financial ability to support yourself, you may be eligible for SSI. Recognize, if you get money or resources from some place else, your funds from SSI will be GREATLY reduced.
2) You can’t save TOO much SSI.
Now, I know it’s easy to want to keep a little to the side. Be careful because after a particular point, the amount of money you have saved will NOW become an asset that can count against you. (Unless you have Special Needs trust but that’s a WHOLE different topic)
3) If you get some extra money, spend it!
Ya’ll know what I”m talking about here. Someome dies and leaves you an extra house. You win the lottery. You slip and fell at a store and got a settlement. WOO HOO! It’s party time. So you decide that you are going to save your extra money and just live on your SSI and only USE your savings when you have to use it. WRONG!! If SSI is aware that you have extra funds, those funds are going to be counted against your SSI until you spend those funds down.
4) SSI is USE IT OR LOSE IT!
When I tell people SSI is USE IT or LOSE IT, I am really trying to tell them that if you get money from some other source that results in your benefits being reduced, after a period of time you may lose your SSI altogether.
5) They look at your house hold!
Do they look at your household?? OOOOO BUT YES!! They look at whether you are staying for free or if you have to pay rent. They look at the finances of the household as well. Like I said, they look at your household income
6) You can’t hide funds from the federal government so WHY try??
You do realize that almost every source of funding you receive is attached to your Social SEcurity number, don’t you? An IRA? Lottery? Settlement? All of these? Of course! Most of these sources have to report to the IRS so guess what happens when that information hits the system?? YOu guessed it!! SSA will find out.
7) When you get it, TELL!! After you spent it, TELL AGAIN!
Some people are fearful of telling people about the money they receive but I’m a firm believer that you save yourself SO much drama by being up front and being truthful. And after you spend the money, you want to make sure you take the time to go back and tell that you have spent all of the money so it doesn’t affect your SSI too much.
You got 12 months and then it’s GONE!!!!!!
Most people don’t realize that if your SSI benefits are discontinued, it is placed in a Suspended status. What is a suspended status? This means that if you tell SSA your situation has changed, you may be able to get your benefits reinstated. After 12 months, your status goes from suspended to terminated. What is a terminated stataus? This means that you have START OVER!!
9) Receipts! Receipts! Receipts! Keep them, save them, and show them!
This way is the best way to protect yourself. If you get some extra money, keep receipts because you want to be able to show SSA that you spent the money.
SSI is a tricky program because almost every little money from OTHER sources will affect it. Even more, they don’t always tell you that it is being affected until AFTER it has. Keep SSA in the loop about your financial changes so you don’t get caught off guard.
Whether it’s Conan O’Brien or Jay Leno, you’re still an employee! Don’t take it personally!
If you are one of those million people who have been engrossed in this whole process of watching all of this drama unfold before your very eyes, you are probably saying to yourself, “Give me a break”.
You’re probably not moved by the fact that Conan O’Brien will be getting $45 million dollars to leave his job and Jay will get his old job back. It’s easy to look at their situation and think to yourself “Man, they got money coming out of their ears so why should THEY be pressed!”. This situation sounds ALOT like what we regularly see in professional sports. Big time athletes being bought of their contracts. We get so caught up in the glow of the money being thrown around that we still ignore one FUNDAMENTAL point.
THEY are STILL employees!!!
Wrap your brain around this fact. Conan sat and waited for the opportunity to move into this position. How many of you have found yourselves in this position where you are sitting and waiting patiently for your opportunity. You’ve been the model employee. You’ve worked hard. You’ve kept your nose clean. You’ve done everything you’ve been asked to do. Then, at the last second, something happens. A business decision. Nothing that relates to you but it is a decision. Now, all of sudden, you’re no longer the person being looked at for the job. Even worse, someone else is hired for that exact same position right before your very eyes. At best, you can wait patiently for your next opportunity. At worst, you would have wasted your time with the hopes and aspiration that that door may open again.
It’s easy to look at a pro athlete or a tv personality or even a corporate mogul and say, ‘they aren’t hurting. they getting paid’. However, money doesn’t always LESSEN the sting. Sometimes, the situation itself is a blow to your ego. It’s a blow to your emotions. It’s a blow to your reputation. Think about it. If you were waiting all these years for your chance and it passes you by, you would wonder (and others MIGHT wonder) if the problem wasn’t a business decision but maybe a lack of faith in your ability to rise to the occasion.
Taking money OUT of the equation, the simple fact is that we all tend to get emotional invested in our employment. Our jobs and our ability to do our jobs tends to be direct reflection on us. We don’t play around when it comes to that reflection. We know our job today will impact our jobs for tomorrow. We know that people look at us based on our skill, our position, and our status. Those things are personal and NO amount of money can remove that from us.
The hardest thing that alot of us will face is someone telling us that “business is business”. When you’re an employee, it’s a reality that you know but it’s also a reality that is hard to sometimes accept. When you’re an employee, you understand that a considerable amount of your livelihood is dictated by the impression and perceptions of others. So you do everything you can to make that a reality. Unfortunately, in the grand scheme of things, all too many times, employees find themselves in the tough position of taking a decision that is made above them personally.
No one is saying that you should be a robot and that you should disconnect your feelings from your job. It’s not an easy task to do. However, it is important to remember that at the end of the day, even though employers typically will look out for your well being, the viability of your employment is based on the bottom line. It’s not sexy but it is, what it is.
It’s important that you do everything YOU do to ensure that YOU strive to and continue to maintain the best image and reputation for yourself.
Will someone PLEASE tell me how Long Term Disability will affect my Social Security Benefits??
I can’t tell you how many times I have found myself in the position of having to explain how a person’s Long Term Disability program will affect their Social Security disability benefits. I have seen more people PISSED off, angry, and upset because they didn’t have a full appreciation of how that program would affect their benefits.
With that being said, let me give you a few tips that may help you out along the way:
1) If you don’t know BEFORE you sign up, Call your carrier and ASK!!
If you’re thinking about applying for Long Term Disability, check with your carrier and find out how your LTD program will be affected by Social Security. It’s important to have this information available to you in the very beginning.
2) If you have signed up and you don’t know, Call your carrier and ASK!!
So many times, people will start the process of applying for Social Security and think that their LTD benefits and SSD benefits will go ‘hand and hand’. Don’t let yourself get caught off guard. Ask as soon as possible.
3) It sucks but you may have to reimburse them.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but some LTD policies require you to reimburse them if you receive monies during the same time they are paying you. You might want to know that ahead of time.
4) It stinks even more but your LTD benefits may be reduced after you get disability benefits.
Be careful. Sometimes, you are sitting over there doing the NEW math and thinking that you will get money from LTD and your SSD. This point may be true but it is possible that they may reduce your benefits to account for the SSD money you are getting so you need to be ready.
5) It stinks the MOST but your LTD benefits may STOP after you get disability benefits.
OOOOOOO, this is point that makes people HOTTER than fish grease. Let’s say you’re getting $1000 a month in LTD benefits and then a year from now, you start getting $1200 in SSD. So in your mind, you’re thinking “BAM! $2200 a month? We ROLLING!”. And then what happens? you are only getting $1200! Say what? Who bumped their head? Well, it might have been you if you haven’t checked your policy and your policy has a provision that STOPS your LTD once you get your SSD.
6) They want to know about the status so get READY or you may have problems.
I know this will get on your nerves but they are going to want to know REGULARLY about your SSD process. For some policies, if you don’t have an active claim, you don’t get any money.
7) Don’t wait until AFTER you get your benefits to contact your LTD carrier to find out how it will be affected.
Most people get the SHOCK of their life because once they have gone through the 2 years or so of waiting for your SSD benefits and you think it’s cool and then BOOOOO YAAA! you get your SSD benefits. your back pay goes to your LTD carrier and you stop getting LTD checks. NOW, you are mad and don’t want to do. Unfortunately, you may not be able to do anything.
Now, don’t get me wrong. LTD programs are AWESOME! THey provide some well needed money when you’re sitting over there waiting on the SSA process to unfold. Just recognize this point. The LTD program may not be designed (depending on your policy) to keep you covered forever so you need to EDUCATE yourself about what it covers so you don’t get surprised.
What happens after I file a discrimination claim? What happens if I want to sue the employer for discrimination?
Let me provide you some information regarding your employment case which Ihope will give you some greater insight into the discrimination administrative and litigation process.
In most instances, your claim starts with a filing with the Federal Equal Employment Opportunity Commission. Some states have a state equivalent to the EEOC. In addition, in those states, filing with the EEOC constitutes filing with the state counterpart.
Now, under the federal regulations, the EEOC has 180 days to investigate your claim from the date of your filing before you are entitled to ask for a “Right to Sue” letter. Which means, in the 180 days, the law requires that the administrative agency must be given the opportunity to independently investigate the allegations regarding your case. Now, the EEOC is not bound take make any determination in 180 days. This time period is provided in order to permit the agency the appropriate amount of time to investigate.
After 180 days, the charging party (i.e. you) can ask for a “Right to Sue” letter. You have to be careful about asking for the letter before the 180 days because you risk the possibility of the case being thrown out in court due to not allowing the administrative agency the opportunity to properly investigate (thus the phrase “exhausting your administrative remedies”).
Now, under the state regulations, you may be under the same criteria but it’s important that you investigate to determine they have the same time lines. It’s important because you want to ensure that you protect your state rights as well as your federal rights.
In most, the magic number is 180 days. You gotta let the agency do their investigation in order to exhaust the administrative remedies.
Now, what usually happens is that one of the agencies will take the lead and do the investigation. What happens is that they will contact you and the employer and see if you want to mediate. If the employer thinks they did nothing wrong, they may not mediate (even if they do agree to mediate, they may not think they did anything wrong but may be considering settling just to get rid of the case). So in this case, the case goes back to the investigator. What usually happens is the investigator will ask for a position statement from
the employer (which usually means their rebuttal to what you said). Then,the investigator will start his or her investigation regarding your case.
Usually, there is no time line to respond. And usually after the employer responds, that is the point when the investigation begins. During this time period, you will usually wait for additional information from the investigator as well as provide any updated information you may obtain.
Keep in mind that the investigation process is not bound by any time line. They can take as long as they need to take in order to come to a resolution. In addition, since we are in a down economy, a lot of their investigators are severely backlogged so it may take a while to move on your case accordingly.
Once it gets close to the 180 day mark, it may be time to decide if it’s better to allow the EEOC to continue their
investigation, ask for a right to sue letter for federal court, or just file a law suit in state court
Right now, the worst part of the process but the most important part of the process. You’re in the 180 day administrative period
where you literally have to sit and wait.
Ultimately, whenever you’re filing a charge against an employer, three things can happen. One, they can settle in the early phases of the
administrative investigation (which your employer declined to do). Two, the investigating agency may determine that they violated the law or didn’tviolate the law or they can’t tell. Finally, you can sue your employer.
The bottom line is that you are seeking compensation for damages you incurred by your job loss as a result of their actions. The reality is that in this economy, some employers will not compensate you until they are sued and, even then, they may MAKE you take them to trial in order for them to pay. Every case is different and the starting number in an employment case is zero since most employers will argue that they owe you nothing to start.
If you have to go to court, that’s a whole new process. With any court case, you have to sue the other party. They respond. You provide a request for discovery and they provide one back to us. Ypi have to depose witnesses and you will have to be deposed. They will
file motions. You will file motions. This whole process take another year before you even put a jury together to fight it out in court. So even if you get the right to sue letter, you might not go to trial until some time in the next year.
I know that sounds wild but follow this timeline. If you file a law suit in February 25, 2010, you have to serve it to them. That’s a couple of days. They may have 20 days to respond. You will file a request for documents and information. That’s another 30 days. So that puts you into April 2010. They will ask for documents from you and from you. They will give you 30 days. That takes you into May 2010. Youu will depose people from their job and they will depose you. That will probably happen in June or July 2010 (if you’re lucky). If you
have everything you, you may try to set the case for trial. Courts typically set the trial for 3 to 6 months out (Depending) so that will easily take you into 2011. Now, this is purely hypothetical but I wanted you to get an idea of how long this thing will
last so you can brace yourself and your family for the time you have to wait.
Remember, the employer doesn’t think they did anything wrong so they are under NO obligation to give you anything until they decide they want to or a jury / judge orders them to give you something. The process I describe is merely designed to give you an indication of what you will be facing if you have to go the distance.
I know it’s hard but it’s important to understand that it’s a process that you must go through and it takes time, money, and energy. Be patient.
Is there anything I can do to speed up getting my back pay after I’ve been approved for Social Security Disability?
Happy New year and let’s get ready to rumble!!!!!!!
This question is one that I get on a regular basis. You’ve been waiting for a year or two for your final decision and NOW, you got it. WOOO HOOO! PARTY TIME!!
But HOOOOOOOOLDDDD UP, WAIT A MINUTE! Let me put some BOOM in it
You have to wait! Say wait?? Didn’t you wait almost 2 years to get to this point and NOW, you have to wait some more? What the hell???
Calm down, calm down, there’s a reason why it takes a few months. They have to calculate your back pay. They have to adjust for any money you received in the interim while you were waiting. They have to determine Cost of Living Allowance. They have a lot of calculations and they don’t RUSH them.
However, i’m sure you not coming to this post to read about what the SSA is doing. You want to know what YOU can do to speed up the back pay process. Since it’s not always that neat, let me break it down into 3 categories of benefits (SSI only, DIB / DWC only, or Concurrent). I’m, also, focusing on special situations as well that you may need to know:
SSI Only (SUPPLEMENTAL SECURITY INCOME)
1) Notify your local SSA office as SOON as you get your written decision
2) Contact the SSA office and determine when you can do your resource interview.
3) Take all documents that you need to show your finances with you to the resource interview.
4) Let them know about any finances you received during the time since you applied.
5) Have a bank account ready if you can create a direct deposit.
6) All of your benefits are calculated in the LOCAL office.
DIB / DWC (Disability Insurance Benefits / Disability Widows Claims)
1) Make sure you notify your local SSA office as soon as you get your written decision.
2) For the DIB claim, if you have kids under 18 y/o, make sure you let SSA know so they can calculate the dependent benefits.
3) Benefits under this program under calculated in a payment center outside of the state you are located.
4)) Make sure you let the local office know what your bank account is.
Concurrent claims
1) Concurrent claims are those claims that both SSI and DIB.
2) These claims typically are calculated FIRST in your local office (The SSI part) and the DIB portion is transferred to a payment center out of state for the DIB.
Now, most of these things are fairly straight forward so it’s not a big thing. However, there are few things that might make your claim drag. Here are a few of those things:
1) Do you need a REP PAYEE?
If SSA is requiring you to have someone to handle your money, your claim won’t move unless you give them the name of someone OR they provide someone.
2) Do you owe the County some money for housing?
In most states, SSA and the local County have agreements so they are reimbursed if the County is paying your housing. As such, they may get reimbursed first (This situation is typically for SSI claims).
3) Were you receiving VA benefits? Were they service connected or non service connected?
If you’re getting money from ANY source during the period of disability, your SSI will be affected. However, if you received VA benefits, this may have an impact on your DIB. If it’s service connected, your DIB shouldn’t be affected. If it’s NON service connected, your benefits may be reduced.
4) Were you receiving workers compensation benefits?
If you’re getting money from ANY source during the period of disability, your SSI will be affected. however, if you received Workers Compensation benefits, you will have a definite offset from your DIB benefits.
5) Did you work during the period of disability?
If you’re getting money from ANY source during the period of disability, your benefits will be affected by any work you may have performed during the period of time.
6) Were you receiving Long Term Disability benefits?
I always make it clear to my clients that it is important to contact their Long Term Disability carrier to make sure that you are aware of HOW your policy is affected by receiving Long Term Disability benefiits. It’s tricky because for some policies, your benefits may be affected by the money your LTD carrier was paying.
7) Do you owe Child Support or some other debt that the government can recover?
As I have said in previous post, the Government typically has arrangements with certain state or federal entities to ensure that if you owe money (like an IRS debt or child support), the government will a portion of their money first.
I know this information may be confusing but this information will be very helpful to you in an attempt to get your case paid faster.
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